A judge has ordered the Senate to immediately produce the records it has related to the audit of the 2020 election — even those in the hands of Cyber Ninjas Inc., the private firm hired to conduct the review.

Maricopa County Superior Court Judge Michael Kemp on Tuesday rejected last-ditch arguments by the Senate and Karen Fann, its president, that he should hold off issuing a final order. The judge said there is no need for further litigation, saying that the question involves “undisputed issue of fact.”

And the fact is, he said, the records are public.

More significant, Kemp rejected arguments by the Senate that it is immune to being sued over the records.

Despite the order, however, it could be some time before American Oversight, the self-described nonpartisan watchdog group which is seeking the records, actually gets them. Attorney Kory Langhofer, who represents the Senate, said he will seek an immediate stay of Kemp’s order from the state Court of Appeals.

And even if that fails, the fact remains that some of the documents that Kemp ordered the Senate to produce are in the hands of Cyber Ninjas.

“I can’t produce something I don’t have,” Fann told Capitol Media Services.

Kemp, however, was not impressed.

“Defendants’ claim that they have not even seen the documents of Cyber Ninjas Inc. and its subvendors does nothing to advance their position,” he wrote. “Willful blindness does not relieve Senate defendants from their duties and obligations under the public records law.”

Less clear is whether records produced will give Arizonans a better look at who really is funding the audit.

Cyber Ninjas CEO Doug Logan released a report last week listing what he says are groups that contributed more than $5.6 million, above and beyond the $150,000 spent by the Senate. But those groups, mostly tied to Trump or organizations that allege conspiracies in the 2020 election, are not required under federal law to list their individual donors.

A spokesman for Logan said there would be no further details released. There is no indication whether Cyber Ninjas has that information and whether it would be provided through the public records.

The court order comes as Sen. Sonny Borrelli, R-Lake Havasu City, has asked Attorney General Mark Brnovich to investigate the refusal of Maricopa County to comply with the latest subpoena, including production of the county’s routers that direct computer traffic.

A spokesman for Brnovich confirmed the request. But it remains unclear, however, whether the attorney general has any power to get involved.

It is true that Maricopa County Superior Court Judge Timothy Thomasson ruled earlier this year that the Senate is legally entitled to the information it is seeking. And Thomasson brushed aside a series of contentions by the county that the subpoena was not valid.

Thomasson said, however, the remedy for enforcing that subpoena rests with the Senate itself which has the power to hold anyone who does not comply in contempt. That same statute also says that someone who refuses to comply can be arrested by the Senate sergeant-at-arms.

But, at least for the moment, Fann lacks the necessary 16 votes to get that contempt citation.

Fann is undeterred, saying Tuesday she believes the Senate has other legal methods of getting what it wants. She declined, however, to spell them out just now.

“When it’s all ready to be tied up in a little bow we will do that,” Fann said.

In the meantime Fann now faces the new court order which, unless stayed or overturned by the appellate court, appears to give her little wiggle room.

Fann said the Senate has responded to public records requests with everything it has. But she has argued that materials held by Cyber Ninjas are not subject to those disclosure laws.

Kemp disagreed, saying that the audit is “an important public function” being conducted by the Senate, making Cyber Ninjas and the firms it hired “clearly agents of the Senate.”

That didn’t stop the Senate’s lawyers from saying that there needs to be more evidence presented — and more legal arguments — before Kemp could issue a final order requiring disclosure. But the judge, in his newest order, made it clear that this was a simple matter and he had heard all he needs.

“The courts, rather than government officials, are the final arbiter of what qualifies as a public record,” Kemp wrote.

“Whether a document is a public record under Arizona’s public records law presents a question of law,” he continued. “Further discovery or more legal briefing will not alter, enhance or diminish the court’s findings on this narrow legal issue.”

Nor was Kemp impressed by the claim that the Senate is immune from claims under the public records law.

“Legislators are protected from liability for their ‘words spoken in debate,’ ” the judge said, quoting from state constitutional provisions. And he acknowledged that lawmakers also are immune from being sued personally for their legislative acts.

But what’s at issue here, Kemp said, is a request by American Oversight for a court order compelling the Senate to comply with its duties and obligations under the public records law.

“The verified complaint is in no way a tort claim against any member of the Senate for personal liability in their individual capacities,” he wrote.

“The proposed order and the court’s findings do not, in any way, interfere with or dictate how the legislature conducts its business or its deliberative process,” Kemp continued. “The court is not dictating how the audit is conducted nor interfering in the audit process in any way.”

The judge also pointed out that Fann herself, in earlier court hearings, said the audit is a legislative function within its role under the Arizona Constitution. That means the records involved in conducting it are clearly public and do not fall within the immunity of state lawmakers.

“Such a broad interpretation would render the public records law meaningless as to any legislator at any time under any circumstances,” Kemp said. “This is surely not within the legislative intent of the public records law.”

In letting the Senate’s audit drag on as auditors demand more subpoenaed materials, Senate President Karen Fann has managed to delay a fight within her caucus over how to handle the eventual results. 

The July 15 impromptu broadcast meeting with Fann, Senate Judiciary Committee chair Warren Petersen and the audit team they hired laid bare ongoing rifts in the Senate Republican caucus, as some responded with calls to overturn election results and others stepped up criticism. 

Sen. Wendy Rogers, a Flagstaff Republican who has been among the most vocal to question the 2020 presidential election results, tweeted partway through the meeting that she had heard enough and it was time to remove President Joe Biden’s Arizona electoral votes – something the Senate cannot do, and that wouldn’t affect Biden’s national victory.  

On the other end of the spectrum, Sen. Paul Boyer, R-Glendale, has renewed his criticism of the audit. Boyer, like all Senate Republicans, supported the concept of a Senate-led audit last winter, but quickly soured on the idea after Fann attempted to hold Maricopa County’s supervisors in contempt and selected the Cyber Ninjas, a firm that lacks election auditing experience and has a CEO who promoted election conspiracies on since-deleted social media accounts.  

“You told us in closed caucus the ‘audit’ would not cost taxpayers more than 150k and you wouldn’t divulge who you were hiring,” he tweeted at Fann. “Had you told us it was an inexperienced, partisan firm, I wouldn’t have been the only one to object.” 

Boyer did not return a call Wednesday. Sen. T.J. Shope, a Coolidge Republican who with Boyer is widely viewed as the closest thing to a moderate left in the Senate Republican caucus, said he wants to get a second opinion on any audit results before the Legislature tries to pass new laws.  

He worked closely with election officials across the state this year to introduce a rare noncontroversial election law bill, with adjustments to filing deadlines and a ban on using slogans as part of a nickname on a ballot.  

“I’ve been at this thing for nine years,” Shope said. “I’ve made relationships with different county recorders across the state and elections department officials, obviously good enough to run a bill that was written the way that they wanted it earlier this year, so there are people that I trust that I would go to with any of these findings.” 

Fann said during an interview last week that she stood behind the audit and would repeat the whole process over again.  

“I think that it’s going to open up a lot of eyes about some improvements that we can make in our system,” she said.  

But her insistence that the Senate is only looking forward at how to pass laws affecting the next election, not changing the results of the prior one, is an unpopular opinion among some in her caucus.  

Along with Rogers, Sen. Kelly Townsend, R-Mesa, has said the Legislature should consider reconvening to attempt to overturn the 9-month-old election results. Townsend is also seeking an Attorney General investigation into Maricopa County based on last week’s hearing, though she said she has yet to hear back about whether Attorney General Mark Brnovich will take up her request. 

Townsend said she wants to change a state law requiring the House or Senate to vote on a resolution to hold anyone who refuses to comply with a legislative subpoena in contempt, thus enabling Fann or House Speaker Rusty Bowers to send the sergeant at arms to fetch recalcitrant witnesses without needing the support of a majority of a legislative body.  

Instead, she said, it should be a class one misdemeanor – punishable by up to six months in jail – for anyone to ignore a Senate subpoena.  

“We’re not going to give up,” Townsend said. “I’m not giving up, and I will do what’s necessary to complete the people’s audit. And if they can’t do it on their own, we will find a way to force them to do it, either now or next year, and if laws were broken, people need to go to jail.”  

Sen. J.D. Mesnard, R-Chandler, said the auditing team came across as professional and competent to him during last week’s hearing, and he blames Maricopa County for delays in completing the Senate’s review. While he hoped the investigation would have been completed a long time ago, he said the Senate can’t stop now.  

“If folks know that they can obstruct and delay, and that if they do that long enough and persist in it that you will just walk away, then everybody will do it,” he said.  

Mesnard, who represents a district won by Biden and Democratic U.S. Sens. Mark Kelly and Kyrsten Sinema, said he isn’t concerned about the audit’s political effect in swing districts like his. The 2022 election should favor Republicans because Democrats hold the White House, House and Senate, and voters don’t usually make their decisions based on a single issue, he said.  

The Senate’s audit has thus far been an entirely partisan affair, and Senate Democrats are waiting to see if they’ll get the chance to review the final results and question the auditors. Ahead of last week’s meeting, Sen. Martín Quezada, D-Glendale, said he received no notice that it was a hearing or he was invited until a Senate staff member sent him a picture of a seat in the audience with a sign saying it was reserved for him. 

Quezada watched the meeting from afar and marveled at why anyone thought it was a good idea. He can only see one way out of the ongoing investigation: for Fann to announce that it’s gotten ridiculous, she’s ending the audit and she’ll accept the consequences.  

“I think that would be a good way, and a good reason to be dethroned as Senate president,” he said. “That’s what I would do if I was her. I would say, ‘Look, guys, this is stupid. We’re ending this.’”